With the ability to sell across multiple platforms, some may believe that the good ole cold call is no longer the best way to make a sale. However, in a crowded selling market, you need to be equipped with the right sales technique to stand out – in that case, having the right phone skills is your ticket to success.
How do you sharpen your phone skills to increase your likelihood of closing a deal?
Paul Ledesma, internationally acclaimed mentor, business coach, and sales consultant is here to help you out.
In this episode of Evolved Sales Live, host Jonathan Fischer sits down with Paul to discuss how using these 7 critical phone skills you will help you elevate your sales.
Don't forget to follow us on LinkedIn for more engaging sales insights and discussions! Happy watching!
With over three decades of work in the world of sales coaching, mentorship, and consulting, Paul Ledesma specializes in helping global organizations sharpen their mindsets and improve their frontline tactics to increase sales.
Check out the transcription of this webinar episode below!
Jonathan Fischer 0:05
Well, it's time for another value packed episode of evolved sales live. Welcome back. I'm Jonathan Fisher. Sales has changed a lot in recent years. Everyone's talking about digital selling social media selling, and for good reason. But one thing hasn't changed. Phone based business development is and will remain a critical element in any truly effective go to market strategy, especially when selling b2b. And today's guest is here to help us with that very thing. Leveraging over three decades of experience inside globally known corporations working in sales, business leadership and organizational development. Paul Ledesma works today as a mentor, coach, and consultant to businesses all across the US and beyond. His specialty is helping organizations sharpen mindset and improve frontline tactics to elevate their sales. And he's here today to help us improve seven critical skills on the phone. Paul Ledesma. Great to have you on the show.
Paul Ledesma 0:58
Great to be here, Jonathan, thank you for that introduction.
Jonathan Fischer 1:01
Yeah, my pleasure. So hey, what what do you do every day in your consulting work? And how did you get into that kind of offering value to the marketplace?
Paul Ledesma 1:12
Great question. It's I've been in sales leadership, like you said, for veteran three decades. And I've always believed that sales training is not going to be effective unless people reinforce it. There's a definite need for salespeople to have accountability. It's very easy for them to get into that squirrel mode, get into doing activities that are not going to be income producing activities. And what they need is strong leadership and strong accountability coaches to help them out. And so I've done that my entire career as a sales leader. But what I'm finding is that now is a sales coach working on that 100% full time, I'm enjoying my life, I no longer have to do reviews, at the end of the year, I don't have to deal with HR, I just get to play with the kids and help them get better at what they do, and send them on their way. And it's been a real great progression in my career to move from being in that executive leadership level into being an actual hands on coach helping people succeed.
Jonathan Fischer 2:14
Love it, you get to do the fun part now.
Paul Ledesma 2:16
Yeah, that's exactly right.
Jonathan Fischer 2:19
So in your work, obviously, frontline selling, I mean, we're developing a lot of business on the phone, trying to get those appointments in the calendar tried to set up for, you know, solid, qualified, pre qualified pipeline. And you're seeing a lot of mistakes being made out there. And no doubt, and I know you're going to share seven skill areas we can improve on. But to just kind of set it up a little bit, what are some some of the most common mistakes that you see being made in the phone selling game today,
Paul Ledesma 2:46
I would say some of the most common that I'm seeing being made are people are just burning and churning through data, they go through those leads super fast, they don't bother to leave a impactful message to get people to call them back. It's a waste of opportunity that I see happening quite a bit. I also see people that have a struggle with their mindset, we'll be talking about that quite a bit, actually. Because I'm finding mindset is being overlooked it too much. I also see people not getting referrals, even in a BD RS role, you still have the opportunity to talk to somebody and see if there's somebody else that you could speak to. So I see that step being skipped nine times out of 10, especially at that BDR level, maybe not at the tenures reps level. But I think that they can still do a much better job and keeping their pipeline full.
Jonathan Fischer 3:41
Well, those those sound like very common mistakes being made. Why do you think they're missing things, even including mindset and not getting referrals? I mean, some of that sounds fairly rudimentary, what's the gap?
Paul Ledesma 3:52
The gap is habit, the gap is being able to develop a skill set that will enable them to be successful. Oftentimes, I find even tenured, tenured people, I just got off the call with a group where most of the folks that were 20 year loan originators, they've been in the business for a long time. And they're just not bothering to prospect because they've gotten out of the habit. They've spent the last two years gathering because the RE refinance model was just there and they've let their skills of hunting atrophy. And it's helping them get back to the basics and understanding how to develop those relationships with the people they need to develop them with.
Jonathan Fischer 4:35
Do you feel like there might be an opportunity for organizations? You know, I alluded in the intro to the movement over to digital, everyone's giving that so much focus. I wonder if it's pretty common in what you just alluded to that people are getting off of the old school fundamental, whether it's pounding the pavement or working those phones, do you think that might be an opportunity for certain companies
Paul Ledesma 4:55
100% a matter of fact, I just mentioned that call. I was on up One of the things that was interesting was I called this manager and introduced myself a little bit over a month ago. And he says, Oh, my goodness, somebody's actually calling me on the phone. He was shocked. And he's in charge of salespeople. And that was something that you just shared with me was that, you know, we get constant texts, we get constant LinkedIn blurbs, that sort of the verbal vomit of everything that they're going to do for me. But that human connection, that human touch through a phone or through something like we're doing right now, where we're seeing each other face to face. That's definitely needed by people. And that's the type of touch they do want to continue to have. Everything else is just becoming noise.
Jonathan Fischer 5:47
And what was the title of that person, by the way,
Paul Ledesma 5:50
he was a branch manager for a loan origination company.
Jonathan Fischer 5:55
Okay, even a branch manager level, I saw some recent Gartner research that the higher up the chain you go, the more critical that phone piece is, the more they want to be talked to over the phone, and interacted with at a personal level. Even across the board, b2b selling over 51% of those polled do prefer a phone interaction before going to the next step in the sales funnel. So it's definitely a huge thing. So as you're working with your clients, and helping them improve their game with their teams, we've already set it up for seven skill areas. So let's jump in let's let's hit it with like, number one. And you you said mindset was big? Is that kind of your first key,
Paul Ledesma 6:34
then that is my first number one key, I think it really comes down to that they really don't have a fully baked plan when they start in on calling people. And the first and most important part is mindset. Remember, you have been hired to represent a company, a product and a brand. The first thing you have to do is intentionally find your own. Why? Why are you doing this? What benefit are you trying to share with customers? What is it that you believe in about your product? For instance, I'm 1,000% bought into the belief that sales training doesn't stick without reinforcement and accountability. Therefore, that's why I've chosen to be a coach and I, I believe this for decades. So when I contact people, I come in with a passion with the, with the mindset that this is something people need.Your why may be different, it could be a personal motivation, but I find it aligned motivation is going to come through with conviction. If you're dialing without conviction, it's just going to sound hollow. So as a PDR, as somebody who's making these dials, there has to be a formidable reason for you to make that call that you believe in. And that needs to be found first, that is going to make a world of difference in how you approach people.
Jonathan Fischer 7:59
Yeah, if you don't have a real important reason why you're doing the activity, especially when it's grunt work, I mean, it is a grind, right? When you talk in working the phones, you know, you're you're gonna you're gonna make contact with 20 Some percent you're gonna 2% are gonna turn to something you can put in your pipeline. It takes a lot of motivation. So it's really good, what you're talking about, what what are some examples of effective, wise, effective ways.
Paul Ledesma 8:24
For instance, working with some life insurance agents, I have found that I really had to delve deeper. So why are you doing this? Why not something else. And it's because they say, once we get to, because I can help people change their lives and change their legacy. Those are the y's we're looking for, because this is something that is going to be life changing for those people. If you're talking about saas software, and you've got something that's going to work in the medical field, well, why is that so important to you? Well, it's because it's going to streamline the business for everyone that touches it. And that is going and I have worked in a situation where we didn't have streamline processes, and I feel confident that I've got a product that is going to do that for this company. Those are the types of ways you really be connected to what you're doing and why you're doing it. If you can do that, you know, you're on your way to having effective communication.
Jonathan Fischer 9:21
Sounds like there's some homework for some leadership on the this listening to the show, you know, to really, really connect those dots, what is our organizational mission and not some cheesy slogan, and not even a selfish motive? But what do we really do? I mean, at the end of the day, when you're offering value to the marketplace that's touching people and we've said that in other episodes of our program here, that that actually has a lot of value beyond the mere transaction, a lot of value beyond the mere dollars changing hands, there's you're actually solving problems. So I love that you bring that to the fore. Another key that you mentioned in your training is scripting. Now that could be a controversial topic. A lot of people Total sales leadership. And there's definitely a wide range of opinions from those who love them. And I want to every word and I'm gonna monitor that to a tee to those who like the script, forget about it. Where do you come down? Like, how do you define script? And how does it play a role? How's that important?
Paul Ledesma 10:17
Well, I have to admit, I was one of those sales guys that I don't need to be scripted, I can just wing it, I'm gonna be able to hear what they say and respond to it in kind. But over the years, I've discovered one thing scripting is the highest form of communication. You is done with a purpose, you are writing out words and thoughts and plans, with a purpose to share with your clientele. And the more you get that in grayned, into who you are, and what you do, it becomes much easier for you to share the salient points for whatever customer you're listening to, and hearing what their needs pain points, what those are, to be able to utilize a script, or even a story to be able to illustrate why what you're sharing with them is important and relevant to what they do. The one thing I would say about scripting is most salespeople do resist it. They because the words are not theirs. And I understand that completely. But as you review a script that you have, what can you do to make it your own? What can you take from those words that were written by somebody else? And say, Well, why is that? Why is this phrase in there? What does it mean? And why would it be relevant to the customer, and find ways to make it your own. Oftentimes, people try a script half heartedly, it fails, and then they blame the script, that script doesn't work. But if that's the case, return to step one, which is mindset, and figure out what your y is, and incorporate that into your script. So what I would tell all leaders is before asking BDRs STRS, to pick up a phone, build a script, and then help them make it their own, help them make it sound, make it sincere, not sound sincere, I almost made a mistake, but make it sincere, so that they are sharing information that is believable to themselves and things that they would like to share with others.
Jonathan Fischer 12:28
And it sounds like you're not asking for folks to literally memorize it the way you would recite a poem, for example. But you it's more of a guide, maybe something akin to an actor who has to, you know, make it make it her own personality, it kind of brought out through the character she's portraying, is it something a little bit more like that?
Paul Ledesma 12:47
I would agree. I would agree. It's more like that. I would agree that people starting off with a script, who haven't had any experience, should go through the script and learn what nuances they need to put on it to initially make it sound better to themselves. But as time progresses, keep honing that script and keep making sure that script becomes part and parcel of what you're sharing. We don't want everyone to become robots, but your scripts are going to be can be broken down into pieces. And as you hear and want to respond to customers, you can take out certain pieces of that script and utilize them in that moment. And that's where the scripting becomes really important is that you have your go to understandings acknowledgments of the customer, and then your response.
Jonathan Fischer 13:37
So why can't you do without a script? Like why can't you just cut your salespeople loose and learn to have conversations and make things happen? What's wrong with that?
Paul Ledesma 13:45
I think the problem with not having a script not having your pieces and your ducks in a row is that you will tend to get off track, you will tend to go down the rabbit hole with the customer while and not be able to stay on point not to be able to stay on message. I find sometimes customers will will just string you along and take you someplace where you weren't intending to go. And it's really important to keep the momentum moving forward in the conversation so that you can properly respond and showcase your product but at the same time, earnestly listen to your customer and be able to take what their concerns are, and remedy those concerns through your through your scripting.
Jonathan Fischer 14:30
That's awesome. So you talk a lot about the importance of voicemail and that's another one where you're gonna get a variety of opinions. Is it even worth it? Do you do it after the first call versus second or third call or what do you say? So give us your insights on the voicemail game.
Paul Ledesma 14:47
This is something that's a really amazing and I've talked to a lot of sales professionals over the years, you'll see people who never leave a voice message because they don't think that people respond you'll have other people say I get70% of my voicemails returned, and I'm probably on the second half, I'm between 50 and 70% of my voice messages returned.Simple Steps to take the first call you you make to that client. And if this goes to voicemail, I don't leave a message that indicates it's not a good time of day to give a call. But then I choose another time of day and make that call. And I leave a mystery message. It's very simple. Basically, I just share with people, Hey, my name is Paul, I gotten pointed in your direction and somebody I should talk to have a couple of questions I could use your help on, if it could give me a call back. Here's my phone number. And with that, I get a good 50% of my calls back. I didn't mention my last name, I didn't mention what company I was with. I was honest with them. I do I was pointed in their direction. And I do have questions in order to find out if what I can do for them is something in alignment with what they need. But by keeping it simple, by keeping that message simple, people have an intrinsic desire to help others. And by sharing that little simple message, it becomes a very easy way to get people to call you back. And if you have a referral. If somebody referred you to that person, it's perfectly fine. Hey, my name is Paul. George said I should talk to you, I have a couple of questions, wondering if you could help me out I can be reached at. And those calls come back quite frequently. And it's better than churning and burning through the data. Because leads are finite, the quality leads are even harder to come by. So make sure to make every opportunity to make a contact with somebody and engage them because that's where the real work begins. Well, if you're getting it, you know, a 2% response versus 52 or more response rate that that that definitely makes it more worthwhile.
Jonathan Fischer 16:59
Take those extra few moments and leave a voicemail. I like that a lot. So we also talk about what you get someone on the line, the way that you approach that conversation is really critical. Talk to us about the approach like What do you mean by that? And how do we implement?
Paul Ledesma 17:13
Well, quite frankly, I'm talking to somebody, they don't know who I am. And we're just getting to break the ice. So what I want to do first is to create an interruption of a thought interruption, because they're trying to figure out how to respond to somebody they're talking to you that they're an unfamiliar with. So my simple approach is pretty fun. It just says, Hi, George, this is Paul. And they pause at Paul Ledesma. And they say with a big smile on my face. If you're trying to place a face to the name, it's okay if you can't, we haven't actually met. But we do have a mutual connection. And that's when I bring up the the person who referred me or the the business entity that we're talking about. This is where you can bring up that person and the common business interest and lighten the load nine times out of 10. People smile, they laugh, they get it that that there was this tension where I was trying to figure out who you were, but it's okay. And it really opens up the conversation to the next step, which is really getting involved in to sharing with who you are and what you're about.
Jonathan Fischer 18:20
That's cool. Is there a broader approach you can use? If you're just you know, maybe like you could curate a list I could see doing that have contacts that where you have some kind of connection to refer to? What if you're just you know, you're that SDR, you're churning through numbers, and all you have is their name and their company's flashed on your screen? Do you have a stock way that you could still make that work with integrity?
Paul Ledesma 18:41
I think the way you would make that work with integrity is bring up the fact that you are working with other people in that industry. You know, you don't know me for Adam, but I've been working with Fred at this company, and Jeff at this company. And the common interest, the common interest is that we're all in this business. I'm with my company, can I have you heard of us? And it? Again, it brings up that letting people know that you are there with a purpose and that you're doing you are working with others in that profession, and that you are intent on working with them as well.
Jonathan Fischer 19:17
Yeah, that makes sense. I think, you know, as a sales leader, you could curate your list and even have like, hey, in this vertical. There's, here's some accounts that we have or that we're working on that would say something to this group of contacts and so forth. And really make that make sense that there's actual integrity behind that. So that's I think that's really key. I'm sure you would agree.
Paul Ledesma 19:37
Absolutely. So in that approach, which that's the way you just modeled that. That does sound really friendly. You probably would get me to listen to the next thing. That's great. There's something else you mentioned about the phrasing and something you should do every time you make a statement. Oh, what was that?
Well, the statement with the phone is that my name is Paul I am with XYZ Company. Have you heard of us?I end everything I do with a question. That is extremely important, because again, it's a thought disrupter. They may be thinking of ways to get off the phone. But as soon as as Have you heard of us? They're just going to respond. No, I haven't. And then I say no worries, let me share a little bit about what we do. And if it's something of interest, great, if not a big deal. If not, no big deal, we'll just shake hands and move forward. Is Would that be okay? It's a very friendly, non threatening approach, if something of interest great, if not, no big deal. And then I share with them what we do and XYZ we do this. And for instance, this other company, we supported them by streetlamps lining, streamlining one of their activities, resulting in a 25% increase in productivity. What is your team currently working on to improve that aspect of their business? Again, ending with the question, I just shared how he was able to increase productivity by 25% with another client. But then I just say, I don't say, Does that sound good to you? I don't know what the yes or no question. I don't end it with hoping that they say, well, that's great. I just ended it was what is your team currently working on in order to improve that aspect of your business?
Jonathan Fischer 21:26
Yes. Good. One of the listeners actually had anticipated open ended questions. So yes, good, right. The more you're getting them to talk, the more the guard should be going down, right? You're now you're in more of an actual conversation. I really like that. So ending with a question is important. Someone says, Well, why is that? And I say, Well, why not? Yeah, so it's great to have questions throughout. And then you mentioned the importance of using storytelling is Well, talk to us about that, why that matters. And give us some of the application of story and how that can maybe even solve some problems or even preclude some issues in a conversation.
Paul Ledesma 21:57
Storytelling is extremely important. It's one of the things I really focus on with my sales clients is that quite often we're programmed to share what our products will do. from our own perspective, we're telling them all about the great things that our product is going to do plus make the kitchen sink sinks shine. And that gets lost on most people receiving the message. So instead, when I respond to objections, or do my presentation, I tend to tell a story. From somebody else's point of view, I rely on my experiences to tell stories. So when talking about what you do, talk about what you did to serve another customer. And the results bring up the fact that, you know, I had a customer, again, a little bit like feel like feel felt found, but with a little bit more depth to it, that you are able to recall somebody who perhaps had a similar circumstance. I was working with a life insurance agent the other day, and he's fairly new to the business. But one of the things I suggested to him was to go on a call, where a check is being delivered. After somebody had passed away. That's good. So that story is that story is super powerful. Go on there, go on that you don't have to be the sell, seller, the insurance, just go on that. And you are going to see firsthand the impact that your product has made on somebody's life and legacy. And I remember I was in shirts long time ago, but I remember going on that trip. And it was life altering for me when I saw that family who lost their primary breadwinner, lost, spent a lot of money on hospital bills, and the fact that we were able to make sure that the house was paid off, the cars were paid off, there's no more consumer debt, and that there was legacy money left for the children that were eight 910 years old, to go to college.I still get emotional about it. It's it's a real powerful moment when you put yourself in there. And that's a story that as an insurance agent, you want to be able to share with others that this is this is the consequences of doing something and then asking that customer so if that person had not chosen to make that purchase at that time, what do you think the alternative consequence would have been? Yeah. And it's good, really have them own that and get that piece. So for me storytelling is is huge. No matter what you're selling, you're telling about how you've made an impact to other people's lives to their business, especially in b2b to how you've created a new opportunities for people. Those stories resonate a lot more than me just saying, hey, you know what, we sold life insurance to someone and because of that the family was taking Take care of yeah, yes, that's not much of a story. That's not much of a, of an emotional consequence to think about. So again, people hear the logic, but they buy on the emotion. And, and My only rule for telling stories is it must be true. Yeah, people will see through the the fake stories, you'll just, you'll sound hollow. So put yourself in a position to get some real stories that you could share with customers, and you will make an impact.
Jonathan Fischer 25:32
That's really, really good. There's some more homework for the leadership that's on the call today on the show today. Because so often what passes for a case study? If it can listen, if it can fit on one page, you're doing it wrong, in my opinion, okay, yeah, they were doing X numbers and blah, blah, we did these things, ABC blah, blah, blah. And here's the new numbers, blah, blah, blah. With some nice charts, graphs make it pretty. To my mind, that is not the case study, because you're not telling any of the human story behind it. And I don't care if it's a SaaS solution, and you sold it to a NASDAQ company. You know, it's still there, there were human beings that were affected and with whom you interacted, to get that deal to close, I want to know what that story is. Right? If you're selling to me, I want to know that some other folk were the similar situation, like you said, and I love how you're getting there first with your that whole fuel cell found old school as you wait for an objection. And you're like, Yeah, I understand how you, you know, I'd say a few others that felt that way to be, you know, what they found is, and that can be good. But how much better if you got there first? Right. And you've already kind of been allayed some of the fears, you know, they're gonna have with really effective storytelling, it almost makes me think that just the even the art of storytelling could be a good skill to work on with your sales team. Would you agree?
Paul Ledesma 26:45
Absolutely. That is, as a coach, with Southwestern consulting, that is a major focus for us when we look at presentation, and help making sure people understand that that is the crux of making that connection with a customer that's ready to make a buying decision.
Jonathan Fischer 27:05
Well, we've blown through our half hour together, Paul, and you still have one more key and we had the bonus section we were going to share. And we also would have some q&a. So for those of us on the live show, if you can stick around, we're going to hit that seven key, and we'll leave some time for your questions and a little bonus section that we have. So what's the seventh skill? All right. Now most people say Okay, close it, that must be the seventh skill.
Paul Ledesma 27:31
Yeah, maybe it is it technically you're right. But what I think is more important is getting referrals, and making sure that you are following through on the sales process, the sales process, if you don't have a referral component in, in it, you are missing out on a lot of business. So when a customer says yes, they are making an emotional choice, they have not only believed into the logic of what they're doing, but they believe that this is going to be the best thing to do for their business, for their family, for whomever is making that purchase. Through stories you've already connected to the heart. And they feel right about the decision they are making. So now's the time to ask for referrals right then in there, not at product delivery, but at the point where they are making that decision. So the first step is to let them know you value them. Thank you, Jeff, I know the conversation that you have with with us will be a value. Ask them why why? Why? Why did they choose to do business with you? Why did they choose to business today? Why did they choose to do business with your company? And let them tell you? I know there are lots of other is out there attempting to connect with you. Can you share with me some feedback? What did I say today that made sense to you to explore this further to move forward? And listen to what they say. They will say a lot of different things. But they'll tell you exactly why they wanted to do business with you how you made them feel. And it's very easy at that point just to say, look, I wish I had 100 customers like you. It's great to hear I love getting the feedback. Who else do you know that I should reach out to that you would like to have that same type of feeling that you have today. Again, connect it back to the feeling. And then if they need memory joggers, for instance, it could be a colleague, a customer, even a vendor, you know, which of your vendors have been struggling with this type of solution? Which of your colleagues from maybe other companies have been struggling with this type of thing? Who do you know, that you think would find this invaluable just like you have? That is the key to getting referrals is by really asking them to tell you what their Why was for doing business with you. Because at that point, they have no reason not to share that message with others.
Jonathan Fischer 29:58
That's really good stuff. So let's do up into some q&a. So one question that is coming from the group today is right on that very point. So if I'm in the middle of wrapping up a deal, I want to tie that down. I can understand I'm a little leery, you know, of jumping over to referrals. At that point, I kind of want to wait for fulfillment, or delivery or what have you, and then do that. Or there, could you? What would you say to that, which turns out that that you're that concerned that right, then I'm in that moment with that one person? But now talking about referrals? Are there risks there? And if so, what are they? And how do I mitigate those?
Paul Ledesma 30:34
First of all, my mindset is there are no risks there, they have made a choice to work with you. And that is a choice that they have taken into high consideration. They could have chosen anybody else, but they chose to work with you. And if you have done your job correctly, in presenting the benefits, presenting the timeframe for rollout for presenting how you're going to check, check in with them. That's all part of the closing, how are you going to check in with them throughout the process until everything is fulfilled? They have no reason not to consider that, hey, you know what, this is a great choice and the sky is solid. That's why they chose to buy from you. It's the perfect time to ask for referrals, you're not going to lose the sentence, somebody's not going to rip up the contract right in front of you. So oh, you asked me for referrals get lost? Yeah, it's not going to happen. The thing that you want to make sure of is that you don't really pressure people for referrals, that you just say, hey, who else do you want? Who Who else do you know that you would like to have that same feeling that you have with working with me. that's the thing that almost sounds like it could be the opposite. Because you're showing that confidence. And that concern, that conviction that what you're doing is a value. I know you've got me almost on the opposite team. I was on the team. I'm kidding. But I think that's really strong. And it does. Again, confidence is really killer there. And that's what that conveys some other feedback from the group here. This is more of a comment. But I'd like to get you to sound off on it have a marketing expert, Heather, who mentioned how she's in the marketing side of it, how it's a frustration on the marketing side, when they're providing everything they're writing, you know, the sales copy and the E blast, and they're doing all this masterful work of scripting, and yet the sales team doesn't seem to really take it, make it their own and seek to embody it. And as she calls it, adding that extra flair to it. And just leaning on marketing, would you resonate with that? And what do you think some of maybe the organizational issues are there that we need to be solved? 100% that resonates, and that is where elite sales, leadership and marketing leadership need to join forces and have a united front and too often they are dichotomous. There's a lot of anger and bitterness. I was recently asked that question actually is, which is harder sales or marketing. And I've been in sales my entire life. And I'm gonna say marketing is actually harder than sales. Because this is the thing and this is what I find from salespeople. that frustrates me is somebody coming up to me and saying follow the stuff marketing is doing is terrible. What do you say that? Well, because because I'm not getting any qualified leads, I'm getting this a bunch of people that I that aren't aren't the best possible client for us. And I'm just there telling them shut up, they made the phone ring, it's up to you to figure out and qualify the people, they they use a broad net to get the phones to ring, it's up to you to narrow it down. And if you can't make that client, that person into a client, what you can do is get referrals from them, what you can do is point them to another resource that is going to give them more of what they're looking for, to establish that relationship. There's a lot of things you can do with those clients that aren't perfect for you. Marketing is not in charge of giving you perfect people because if they were we wouldn't need sealed salespeople. They are there to make the phone rings and to get you opportunities. They're not going to be the best opportunities all of the time. But you are there to make it take those lemons and turn them into lemonade. That's your job as a salesperson. Sounds like maybe this the sales leaders and managers should also formulate or build a really great relationship with the marketing team if it doesn't exist already. I mean, after all, you know, marketing is where you are going to find really great copywriters, and most organizations, they can help get some great scripting started. And then hopefully the leaders can coach the individuals to own that and make it their own. Maybe with your help, Paul, so I would love to help.
Jonathan Fischer 34:44
Yeah, there you go. So let's see if there's other questions.
Paul Ledesma 34:48
Yeah, I mean, there's the thing about scripts keeping out there's a lot of just a lot of resonating comments on here, knowing your product, listen to the customer having those those open ended questions to get engagement.
Jonathan Fischer 35:00
So great, great session today, Paul, thanks for adding value to our audience today the way that you have. If folks want to reach out to you directly, how do they best go about that?
Paul Ledesma 35:11
Best way is you can call me or go to Southwestern coaching.com and at Southwestern coaching.com, just click on coaches and you can find my link. And my email address is plugged Asma P le d. SMA, at Southwestern coaching.com. And there's one thing I'd like to add for any the next 10 People that connect with me or send me a note on LinkedIn. Be happy to send you a copy of this wonderful book called redone redefining possible, written by Dustin Hillis and Ron offered. It's all about mindset and getting your confidence, which was, I think, a major theme of what we talked about. So 10 People random drawing, I'll send you a copy of this book. Just make sure to send me your mailing address and best way to contact you so I can get that book to you.
Jonathan Fischer 36:00
Okay, so you heard it here. So they should mention that they heard you on evolved sales live show next 10 of you that connect with Paul from evolve sales live. You got a free book coming your way in the mail. That's a great offer. Paul, thanks so much for that. Thanks so much to our audience for being here today for another great, fantastic in fact episode of all sales live. And with that, we'll sign off Have a great rest your evening, everybody.
Paul Ledesma 36:23